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Getting the Word Out
Ok, me, I'm one of those people who have no problem whatever making immigrants register, booting ones who cause trouble, holding them in the pokey if we think they know something interesting, etc. Yeah, I know I'm an ugly American that way, but as far as I'm concerned: my house, my rules. And you know what? The vast, and I mean vast majority of other countries act just exactly this way. That's why the state department advises you to contact the US embassy or consulate of your destination whenever you travel abroad. That way they'll at least know who you are if you screw up on someone else's turf.
However, I absolutely and irretrievably draw the line at citizenship. If you're a citizen, you most definitely have rights. Even if you join the wrong side and start shooting at your fellow Americans, if we catch you I absolutely believe in your right to a trial by your own peers with a lawyer provided to you by the state. I may not shed a tear if they strap you to a gurney and give you, as Ellen puts it, the "green juice", but by god you better have had a trial beforehand.
So I just wanted you all to know we got us a concrete case of judiciary abuse going on right now, one in which a citizen is being held in prison for no damned good reason anyone can figure out. C'mon folks, let's get the system working. The whole point of a democracy is ensuring freedom by making it impossible for wacks to take away our rights for any length of time. The best way to kill a fungus like this is to shine a light on it. Let your voice be heard!
Update: Yeah, yeah, yeah, "middle eastern descent." Listen folks, you gotta work your ass off to become a citizen of this country. Takes years sometimes. We make it tough so we can be sure people who become citizens want it with all their heart. The people who become citizens are proud of it in no small part because it's tough. Far as I'm concerned, and I am not joking around here, if you're willing to go to the effort by God you're my equal in the eyes of our laws. If we can let Joe Wacknut spew his nazi-laced hate about white power and the Christian nation and give him police protection while he and his beer-belly buddies wander down main street, we can damned well leave one guy in peace to raise his family and pay his taxes and do everything else you're supposed to do to make it around here, no matter where he was born.
It sickens me to think people would believe otherwise.
Via Skippy.
The FBI just reached into a hat, pulled out a name, marched to OR and arrested this man. There has to be "the rest of the story" as the saying goes.
Posted by: Pat on March 31, 2003 05:06 PMI don't care what the rest of the story is. The guy's a citizen. The FBI plays by the rules with citizens. Habeas Corpus is the rule that says if there's a "rest of the story", they have to share it.
If "the rest" indicates he did something worthy of getting tossed in a hole, well happy for us 'cos he's already there. But since he's a citizen they don't get to play secrets.
Because citizenship is the only thing protecting us from Mr. Ashcroft & cronies.
Posted by: Scott on March 31, 2003 05:13 PMWe are at war!I don't like Ashcraft and some of his cronies but.......
Posted by: Pat on March 31, 2003 07:08 PMAmen about giving citizens trials!
Posted by: Sherri on March 31, 2003 08:19 PMOk, there are just some items that are CLASSIFIED due to the very nature of security of our country and it's allies.
There is probably more to it, and since I can't read the page you linked to, I cannot read between the lines. Don't know the person, so I can't say.
Yes, I agree; if there aren't charges, then the person can not be held.
I don't care if we are at war or not. There are certian lines you don't cross. There are rules you don't break. If it's a classified matter then fine. Haul his #$%^ up before a judge (Not one appointed by the Bush) close the court. And then PROVE that there is a reason for this. Let the guy have his representation. Then let the Judge decide if he needs to be in the can. That's the way the system works. It protects us.
Posted by: jeff on April 1, 2003 09:08 AMUpon further consideration, I will admit you are right and I am wrong. But I just can't get the picture of those jets flying into the WTC on that September morning and the sight of that huge hole in the middle of Manhattan out of my mind's eye.
Posted by: Pat on April 1, 2003 09:54 AMThe guy has a right to due process and to face his accusers, regardless of "state secrets." There ARE procedures in place to deal with trials that deal with "state secrets" and "matters of National Security," they should be following them... fucknits!
I need to dig, but I recall reading a book about a guy who was held ilegally under very similiar circumstances, I think in the '60's. 'twas a hot-button issue back in the fervent anti-communist days. It outlined what the correct procedures were and stuff.
I also have to read that site... I gave it a brief look-see, but I don't have the time right now to read the details of the "Material Witness" bullshit they're using as an excuse....
regardless of whether or not we're at war, civil liberties, indvidiual rights and most importantly The Constitution and laws MUST be observed or we're no better than the Islamofascist dictators we're fighting AGAINST. Security has it's place, but not at the expense of freedom and liberty we've worked so hard and shed so much blood, sweat and tears to secure over the course of the history of this great country.
OK... I'm done.... shoulda done my own post, eh?
Posted by: Jim S on April 1, 2003 03:50 PM